You Dems, always complaining without offering a plan.
I'm sick of hearing that utterly false Republican spin.
I've had the decidedly unwelcome displeasure of having a rather pompous anonymous commenter with a somewhat unhinged obsession with trying to either:
A. Get me to agree with his right wing views as if there's simply no other logical position, this through literally endless comments, and utterly ignoring my every response or answer, or
B. Demanding that I personally present, explain and discuss in detail incredibly complex policy issues such as abortion, health care, and the like. (Like I'm paid to do this or something.)
This strange person, and I only use that term after long experience with them, is at it again.
This time he's got it in his head that I should put forth an entire plan for public supported health care plans. (something of course which is a subject so large and complex that even the major media shys away from it, and which takes dozens of experts who've studied and specialized in the area years to devise.) and then lay it out in blog comments.
The sheer ridiculous nature of that demand aside, I addressed his obsession this time by suggesting he look up the health care plan proposals of the various candidates and get his jollys that way. I made the mistake of thinking he actually wanted to learn about health care policy proposals. Wrong.
As I should have known, that's not what he's after. He doesn't want to educate himself on the details of Democratic health care proposals. He's got his opinion on that from right wing blowhards and that's good enough for him. No, he doesn't want details or explanations, he's obsessed with having me explain it all to him, evidently so he can then breathlessly spring his well rehearsed Republican talking points on me, to which he feels there's simply no way to disagree. (while utterly ignoring all my responses or counter arguments in the process.)
The person really should have their own blog (and did, but it failed). Now they expect to dictate the discussion here, but go completely deaf when I do address their questions and answer them in a way that deviates even slightly with their pre-conceived right wing stances.
At any rate, they recently left a comment demanding a debate on healthcare on a post which had NOTHING to do with the subject whatsoever. (the off-topic comment being yet another annoying habit of theirs.)
They of course demanded that I merely lay out the entire universal health care issue, all of it's various proposals, plans etc. in detail, then lay out MY own personal proposal on how to fix the entire health care system in this country (I don't remember declaring for president), and do all this in comments. (lunacy, I know.)
And this is the same person who loudly bitches if I write a reply that's longer than three paragraphs, saying they simply can't comprehend that much.
Against my better judgement (I should just ignore this crap. It never changes.) I responded. I told them I'm neither capable nor interested in dissecting incredibly complex universal health care proposals, a subject even the major press with their resources seems incapable of doing. (Yet this person demands that a unpaid blogger argue the entire issue....and in comments.)
I suggested that they go look at the candidate's plans on their websites.
That, of course, wasn't good enough for them, since it denied them a chance to regurgitate their goofy right wing taking points. (or in this case, "stalking points".)
I recieved this response from them: (typos entirely theirs)
Dope, THAT is exactly the problem - the candidates have no in-depth position papers.
Their only comment on healthcare is to 'have a singlr payer system.'
Tey, like you, love to critcize, but fall alarmingly silent when asked for details.
Quite easy to say, 'the system is a mess' but a whole new game to actually come up with a tangible thought on how to correct the problem.
Government run healthcare does not solve one fundamental issue - it only makes the taxpayer financially responsible.
So...are you just a blowhard - or do you have specific suggestions on how to better the system?
I will be waiting anxiously for your clever response...
All they want to do is spout goofy right-wing talking points. If I provide any response which doesn't detail an entire national health care plan, or if I decline to tackle such an enormous issue as if I'm both an expert and the sole defender of every candidate's plan, it's just a "clever" dodge. This person is about a half a bubble out of plumb.
The reason I mention all this is to point out that they're simply a liar and lazy on top of it. (OK, OK, harsh, but read on.)
The top Democratic candidates (and perhaps all of them) have devoted entire policy speeches to their plans, that much I knew. The details I assumed could be easily found on their web sites.
It took me all of 3 minutes to find what this dim and argumentative blow-hard casually tells us doesn't exist.
So for his benefit, as well as anyone else that cares to educate themselves on the Democratic health care proposals, (which I highly recommend, if for no other reason than to be able to more easily spot the inevitable right wing lies about it down the road.) here's just some of what I found.
John Edwards has several pages on his health care proposals, including this policy statement.
Barack Obama has an extensive page with several links detailing his proposals to address the health care crisis, even providing a health care policy discussion blog. (at which this commenter could presumably indulge his deep need to argue and demand that others see things his way on this topic, and just as likely be eaten for lunch by people who actually know the subject.)
On the Obama website you can also read an overview of the Obama plan or a document providing full details of the plan, a health care plan Q&A, and a video of his speech on health care policy which he delivered in Iowa City.
And for anyone who wants to delve deeper into the weeds of Obama's health care policy proposal, there's even an extensive article by David Cutler, economics professor at Harvard University and Obama's health care adviser discussing the plan in a way that should make policy wonks rub their thighs in delight.
Hilary Clinton has laid out her comprehensive health care proposals in detail in speeches and provides highlights here.
On her healthcare page, in the sidebar to the right she provides extensive links to the full transcript of her speech introducing her health care policy, state reports, how her plan would affect various groups such as seniors and women, and even a video of her health care speech for those (like the commenter) who apparently don't like to read.
You can also download and digest an entire 16 page booklet explaining her entire proposal.
And that's only three Dem candidates. I'd imagine all the rest have their health care proposals online as well.
As an aside, I also found this article which shows how similar the Clinton and Romney health care proposals are. I hope the commenter doesn't bother to read it, or the congitive dissonence might make his ears bleed.
Again, it took me all of three minutes to find all this, yet this goof makes a fool of himself by parroting the utterly false right wing spin on the subject,
"THAT is exactly the problem - the candidates have no in-depth position papers. Their only comment on healthcare is to 'have a singlr payer system.'
Tey, like you, love to critcize, but fall alarmingly silent when asked for details.
Quite easy to say, 'the system is a mess' but a whole new game to actually come up with a tangible thought on how to correct the problem."
Yeah, "ALARMINGLY SILENT", aren't they?
(The major press might be "alarmingly silent" on covering these plans in any way which might actually inform the public as to what they entail, ( they assume we can't deal with such complex subjects, they're not "sexy" enough, and besides, you can't cover it in less than a minute.) but certainly not the actual candidates who have to struggle to get their plans before the public.)
The spin my echo chamber commenter repeats has been trotted out endlessly for years now. But for the right wing Republican party, facts are mere nuisances, and reality is for suckers.
Will this stop this person from demanding that I personally lay out a complete solution to our national health care crisis and defend it? Sadly, I doubt it.
It would be a worthless pursuit anyway, as I've already heard all the right wing spin already seeking to deny children and the needy health care.
But frankly, I don't want to hear it. I've heard it all before, and I simply believe, from all I've read and heard on the subject as well as my personal views, that the anti-health care spin is almost entirely a bunch of crap cranked out by the enormous industries whose golden goose stands to be taken away. I don't have any interest in hearing some poor schmuck repeating talking points for multi-billion dollar insurance and health care corporations.
I consider it sad to hear average people, people who truly would be helped by improving the system, who out of ignorance, fear, and obedience, argue against their own interests, not to mention society's.
And fundementally, it galls me to hear anyone who argues vociferously AGAINST fixing what is clearly an out of control and horribly flawed system. EVERYONE knows it's terrible the way it is, yet these people can't stand the thought of doing anything about it.
They have, as always, a almost childlike simplicity in their thinking, insisting that every problem, no matter how huge and nuanced, be reduced to simple black and white.
And as with most Republican right wingers, they're motivated by fear. In this case, as with many other issues, all they need to hear is that their taxes might go up, and they react like Pavlov's dogs, instantly wetting themselves and parroting whatever goofy arguments against the policy they can find, facts be damned.
And add to that of course, the horrible worse-than-death spectre of the mere possibility, the mere idea that they MIGHT be contributing a dollar or two to help out someone with brown or black skin or a "poor person". Ewwwwwww! This makes them break out in a cold sweat.
Now of course if every dime of the taxes they've paid for the last 10 yearss ends up paying for a fraction of the cost of some new leather seats for the corporate jet of some corrupt defence contractor... hey, that's cool. Not a peep.
The fact of the matter is that they're already being taxed, and taxed more heavily, by the current health care system, by co-payments and a miriad of hidden costs, yet they're unable or unwilling to comprehend it.
And in the fear catagory again, they've been duped into believing all sorts of unfounded horror stories about the effect of these plans, bullshit about not having any control over anything, and of course, completely false and misleading "facts" about other country's largely successful national health care systems.
So I'm crossing my fingers that this might hold this wanker at bay. But I feel confident that they won't bother reading (much less actually comprehending) any of the health care proposals linked to above. To actually consider that Democrats may have a sound, rational, and reasonable plan about anything is just too far outside their comfort zone. (It's only natural to get a little panicky when your party is sliding down the tubes.)
After all, authoritarians have a deep desire to forego critical thinking. They prefer blind faith and follow their leaders without question, as well as attack all opponents their leaders tell them they should oppose, again, without question. To admit that these plans have merit? Perish the thought.
So next time some winger tries to say that the Democrats "have no plan", tell them it ain't so.